Interview: BSL Bill sponsor Rosie Cooper on her ‘number one’ achievement as a former Labour MP (BSL)

Former Labour MP Rosie Cooper, who first introduced the British Sign Language (BSL) Bill to Parliament as a Private Members’ Bill, delivered a keynote speech at the British Deaf Association’s BSL Conference on Friday – as attendees marked one year since the Act was passed.

The ex-politician for West Lancashire, who is a child of Deaf parents, announced late last year that she would be stepping down as a MP to take on the role of chair of Mersey Care NHS Foundation Trust – a position she was appointed to in December.

After addressing attendees at the conference, Ms Cooper sat down with The Limping Chicken‘s Liam O’Dell to reflect on her Parliamentary career, the future of the BSL Act and her “number one” achievement during her time as an MP.

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In your speech just then, you talked about obviously the BSL Act has passed, it’s gone through the parliamentary process a year ago, and one year on, in your speech, you were talking about you handing this over to the community to champion the Act going forward.

In terms of your role, obviously, now outside Parliament – post-Parliament – but nonetheless, as a CODA, how do you see yourself continuing to champion the Act outside of that establishment, if you’d like?

I’m gone, but hopefully not forgotten. So for me, I can never give it up. I mean, before the Act happened, I’m a CODA, it’s part of my life. A lot of those people out there [in the conference hall] are friends of mine, so the truth is, nothing changes. If I can’t move it, I can phone an MP and ask them to help me do whatever, so I don’t see anything changing, really.

You said progress is slow, and obviously, there’s a long uphill battle. How do you see the government’s attitude to Deaf issues at the moment? You’ve talked about a cultural shift, but also, of course, since the BSL Act has passed, we’ve seen three successive Conservative governments – each with their own different attitudes.

How do you see how do you see that kind of attitude towards Deaf issues fluctuate with those three different administrations?

It’s a pity that we don’t have the same minister, but times and politics change. I think we’ve always got to accept that politicians enrol for a short time and move on. What we got to do is make the agenda relevant and be in their faces.

The more the Deaf community demand of their local MP, demand of their local services, the more people will be there. So it matters, but not as much as people think. Your MP has a platform in that house, and they can talk for you just as well.

This is kind of my thinking on this, and I’ll be intrigued to see if you feel the same way, but you talked about BSL access to press conferences being an issue – still an issue – and how you hope that this will change.

Do you think the first BSL report that the Act mandates, do you think that could have the potential to almost embarrass the government into doing more given the lack of the extent that they’re doing this?

In the spirit of partnership which has got us to this point here, I think we should all acknowledge it’s been a bit slow, but the minute that first report is out, that is the benchmark – we can go no lower and from here on in, we’re looking to Parliament, to the ministers to push this forward.

But it’s not without transparency, because we’ll all be able to see what’s happened. So as I said, benchmark it and we are where we are. Benchmark it, but we’re watching.

Former Labour MP Rosie Cooper, who introduced the BSL Bill to Parliament, begins her speech by thanking @NorwichChloe for being “absolutely brilliant” in working with her to pass the Act last year. #BSLConf pic.twitter.com/Tmnp6VN4DN

— Liam O'Dell (@LiamODellUK) March 17, 2023

Obviously your successor, Ashley Dalton, was elected last month. Have you had any conversations with her about the Deaf community? Does she share your passion for representing that community and culture?

I haven’t spoken to her about it, but there’s a small Deaf community in West Lancs. It’s not a big Deaf community, but they are poorly served, I have to say. It’s not wonderful.

But there are people across the House [of Commons] who are friends of mine, who will be happy to listen and champion the Bill and all that falls out from it.

I mean, here today, I was talking to as people from the financial services community. I suppose the next step is to make sure that Deaf people are financially more aware. We talk about doing it at schools and all the rest of it, but what happens if Deaf people are defrauded? If they’re not handling their money well? There’s huge agendas for us to help. We help everybody – that should include deaf people. I don’t see it stopping anytime soon.

You talked in your speech about representing the united voice – the ordinary voice – around the Deaf community, obviously away from the activists and those that maybe have a bigger platform. Where does that kind of cautionary warning or that cautionary tale come from?

Is it something that you witnessed during the BSL Act campaign? Maybe some people being more vocal and trying to speak for the whole community? Was it something you noticed?

It was. During the BSL Bill time, a lot of activists had a whole history behind them, and they had their point of view – and all very good – but they were all forgetting the absolute outcome had to be a BSL Act, that recognition which will open the door to allow you all to carry on talking and pushing.

I’m beginning to see a lot of people just talking about their part of the agenda. Just because you’re an activist, just because you get on that committee, they’re not the only important voices. Where would my dad’s voice have been?

So yes, it’s important because they are going to be at the table, but they should connect to the ordinary Deaf person community. How do you know what’s going on out there if you’re not listening? And that’s what we ask for: Deaf people to have a voice, not just some Deaf people.

Ms Cooper is stressing about including the breadth of the Deaf community, including young people and the "ordinary Deaf voice" beyond activists. #BSLConf

— Liam O'Dell (@LiamODellUK) March 17, 2023

As you kind of look at the passing of the BSL Act – a kind of touching question, I hope – how would you think your dad would have would have felt at the idea of the BSL Act passing and this milestone being achieved?

He’d be so, so pleased with himself. He would, because he was a campaigner with Paddy [Ladd] and Clive [Mason] – all those people in the 70s and the 80s. He’s died now, but he was always pushing forward, always asking for more, always wanting justice, fairness. The only difference between him and me, was that his ears didn’t work. His brain worked, his hands worked, but his ears didn’t work, and because of that he was held back. It wasn’t right. So yeah, he’d be delighted. He really would.

When I became an alderman of Liverpool, and I was making a speech, and I thanked him because I am my dad’s daughter. People say, if you want to know me, you look at him. I looked down when I was thanking him, and he was just sat on the front row, crying.

As you look back on your Parliamentary career, and your time in Parliament, and all the kinds of things that you’ve achieved, and the roles you’ve played in in passing bills and bringing issues to the attention of ministers… Where does the BSL Act and the passing of that sit in your political legacy, if you like?

Absolutely number one, because that Bill that Chloe [Smith MP, former Minister for Disabled People] and I in partnership delivered, will make a difference to Deaf people today, and Deaf people into the future. It will unlock the opportunities and life chances that my dad would have loved. It’s really good – absolutely number one.

Today, I talk about being a child of Deaf parents. I always signed for mummy and daddy in any important things. People couldn’t be bothered to do all this writing and so just get this child to interpret.

So I would always be arguing for daddy wherever we wanted. So I’ve grown up, I’ve been 28 years a Liverpool city councillor, 17 years an MP, and now chair of a huge mental health and community trust. This is my 50th year in political office.

[Tom Lichy of the British Deaf Association] talked about [how] you can get hearing signing for hearing kids, but not signing for Deaf kids. He actually used a sentence, he said: “From being born to dying, always fighting.” When I read that, that almost summed up my life.

It made me go, ‘whoa’, because I talk about being kidnapped by the Deaf community… What I’m actually saying is, I was my mum and dad’s voice. I was fighting.

Look at me, I’m 72. What’s changed? But I love it. So yeah, I’m grateful that I was born to Deaf parents, I’m grateful for the insight, the opportunity. I wouldn’t change a word of it.

Going into your new role – congratulations. Obviously, you touched upon it in your speech about access to health, you have your own experiences as a CODA and many other CODA will share it, where you had to interpret for your parents at these appointments. How do you see your experience informing your role?

A) I will demand better. B) I will still demand better of ministers. I will just use my experience. I’m not going backwards!

We’ve got mental health, you’ve got deaf prisoners. The agenda’s huge. I mean, I’m not going to fix it all, but I’m going to give it a go – give it a real go. I do intend to carry on making a difference.

Photo: ParliamentLive.tv

By Liam O’Dell. Liam is an award-winning Deaf freelance journalist and campaigner from Bedfordshire. He can be found talking about disability, theatre, politics and more on Twitter and on his website.