Interview with Matt Kirby, CEO-Designate of Signly (BSL)

English transcript:

Rebecca: Good morning! Thank you for joining us here at The Limping Chicken.

Matt: Good morning! Thank you.

Rebecca: Today I’m chatting to Matt Kirby. So today, Matt can you introduce who you are, where you’re from and the new role you have that we will be discussing?

Matt: I grew up in a deaf family in Poole, in south Dorset. So I was born there and lived there until my wife and I had our son (who is also deaf) and we decided to move to St Albans near the deaf school, Heathlands.

My life really changed from that move, being suddenly in new scenarios and environments.

My previous role at Signly was translator – I’ve worked in the past as an actor too. Over the years my work roles have shifted somewhat, I became qualified as a translator firstly but built up a really strong working relationship with the company Signly who offered me several promotions. This culminated in recently being promoted as CEO-Designate of Signly.

Rebecca: Wow!

Matt: I haven’t suddenly been given the role to manage alone, the previous CEO is very much supporting me in the role as I learn the ropes and what’s involved in it all.

Rebecca: That’s fantastic, congratulations. So for those who don’t know of Signly can you tell us more about what the company does?

Matt: Yes, so Signly was founded in 2016 originally a very small company only for providing translations via a QR reader, such as for museums and various places. People could click on an image which would link up to a BSL translation for text or audio.

Lloyds Bank approached Signly about providing translations for their website. We worked out how to enable those using the Lloyds Bank website access information in BSL – they can click on a paragraph of text and a BSL pop up appears on the screen.

From that, Signly has really taken off and provides this service for a multitude of companies enabling deaf sign language users to access information in British Sign Language that’s of a high quality.

Rebecca: Fantastic. So now you’re working as CEO-Designate, are you still translating or has this changed for you?

Matt: I still translate for another company one day a week but with Signly as I’ve been promoted I have delegated all the translation responsibilities I had to the team. This has been hard for me, I’m so used to translating but I’ve had to learn to leave it with our capable team. My priority is to focus on the maintaining of the company.

It’s been quite hard to adjust to this, it’s only been a month so far. I’m now learning about the bigger vision for the company and experiencing first hand all of the preparation and planning ahead that a company needs to do.

I trust my translation team to do their job well and the technical team to do their work well also. Overseeing these teams feels unusual for me but it’s still very new.

Rebecca: It takes time to adjust I’m sure. You mentioned you have two teams; translation and technical, who did you say is mentoring you at the moment as CEO?

Matt: The original CEO, Mark Applin. Mark wants Signly to be deaf led and has been very supportive. He’s stepping down to focus more on the technical aspect of the company as I’ve been promoted.

We have 5 translators in our translation team – so it’s not a huge team – and most of us work remotely. We don’t have one Signly office- it’s all remote.

One of the interesting aspects of the work at the moment is looking at how we work with AI. We don’t provide translations by AI but we want to influence how AI works with accessibility in the future, to ensure sign language is protected and not just used by hearing companies for profit or commission.

Signly wants to ensure the deaf community always gain from these new initiatives. It’s their language, their future so we want to make sure hearing companies aren’t taking advantage of sign language translations in this way.

So it’s important for me to make contacts and network with other companies to ensure we can monitor the future of AI and what it means for sign language and access.

AI will always be out there but Signly wants to make sure as a company, we follow guidelines when working with BSL. At the moment there’s a lot of networking that discusses the safety and ethics of AI with sign language that I am involved with.

Rebecca: So do you expect in the future to see a growth of AI using sign language and you’re aiming to oversee this, is that right?

Matt: Yes. So for example a hearing company may decide to set up an AI translation business with no knowledge of sign language accuracy or context. They will be at risk of sharing information that they assume is accurate – but really isn’t. We all need to look at who is accountable for the accuracy of information being shared in sign language by AI.

It’s not criticising the use of AI but overseeing the use of it, ensuring it is accurate and that deaf people are involved in quality checks and so on.

It should never be purely focused on profit alone without clarity or accuracy because then deaf people will experience more issues and barriers.

Deaf people should be employed to work within the AI company to ensure the sign language used is authentic and correct.

Rebecca: That’s so interesting to envisage in the future how we will be using AI with sign language. Do you imagine it will fill a gap – maybe even in emergency situations where interpreters can’t be found?

Matt: Signly doesn’t work within these four services: healthcare, education, justice and finance. It would be a high risk for AI to work in those four areas.

But in other areas such as information on websites or for transport announcements this wouldn’t pose a problem as such.

Perhaps in future if deaf people could work alongside the AI, this could change things.

Rebecca: How exciting. So you’re one month in the new job. What are you enjoying most about the role so far?

Matt: Having the opportunity to be involved in discussions is so exciting. It’s not about being an authority figure or the power difference of being a CEO versus an employee.

I really enjoy discussing with others on an even platform – regardless of whether we are deaf or hearing. That feeling of equality is important to me. I have been in so many meetings in the past month – I didn’t expect so many! But I’ve really enjoyed being involved and having a voice.

Having a mentor as well has meant I’ve learnt about ensuring I have the physical and mental wellbeing necessary to carry out the demanding role too. It’s learning to self reflect and not let the role take over too much of my life or energy as well.

Rebecca: I imagine being a CEO, it’s a balance to maintain work and home life, now there’s more of a responsibility on your shoulders.

Matt: Yes. Some CEO’s have a large team to delegate to and things in place long term for example, whereas those with smaller companies have to be more involved with the team overall, overseeing and managing.

I’m responsible for the safeguarding of our team and managing any critical feedback or information. It involves having thick skin really! But it’s only been one month so touch wood, all will continue to go well.

Rebecca: You must be very proud and your family also – the first deaf CEO of Signly.

Matt: Yes it’s been incredible especially because I come from a deaf family, my deaf parents always did manual work, they didn’t have the best English. So it feels like such an achievement!

My Dads brother – their family all have University degrees for example, whereas we don’t. But now looking at it, my brother has a great job and I’ve been appointed Signly’s next CEO so I know my parents are very proud.

Rebecca: That’s lovely. Plus you have a deaf child. So he can look up to you and see what you achieve and be inspired by what his Daddy can do!

Matt: I hope so!

Rebecca: So looking ahead, do you have a vision for the future. How do you hope the next ten years pan out? Would you go back to acting?

Matt: I want to work well in my current projects, monitoring the growth of AI in sign language. After that, possibly looking at recruitment, growth of the company, how we collaborate with other companies. I want to be seen as a grassroots CEO who connects with others, leads discussions and involves deaf people at the heart of things.

As for acting, luckily I have some flexibility in my working schedule to keep it in my life. Lately I’ve been absorbed in translation courses and working hard but who knows in the future.

I have seen deaf dramas and deaf actors are doing so well at the moment and I have nothing but praise for them. It’s amazing to see and I’m really glad to see the growth of deaf representation in the media.

Rebecca: That’s wonderful. So maybe one day in the future we will see you back on a camera screen again, alongside your CEO achievements!

Matt: Who knows what’s around the corner?

Rebecca: Exactly, you never know! Thank you so much for chatting to us today. Good luck with your new job and in all future endeavours!

Matt: Thank you so much. I’m so pleased to be appointed CEO-Designate, it’s a challenge but very enjoyable.

Rebecca: Congratulations again.

Matt: Thank you!

Find out more about Signly here.